As the Guardian has noted this morning, Keir Starmer said this yesterday to the Scottish Labour conference:
I have just returned from the Munich security conference, where every conversation I had came back to the situation in Israel and Gaza and the question of what we can do practically to deliver what we all want to see – a return of all the hostages taken on 7 October, an end to the killing of innocent Palestinians, a huge scaling-up of humanitarian relief and an end to the fighting. Not just for now, not just for a pause, but permanently. A ceasefire that lasts. That is what must happen now. The fighting must stop now.
It's a shame it has taken tens of thousands of deaths of innocent people and the displacement of almost every person in Gaza for this point to have been reached. Starmer's delay in understanding the situation in Gaza is inexplicable, and unforgivable.
This week he has a chance to vote on a demand for peace in Gaza. The SNP is tabling a motion on Wednesday in parliament demanding it. He could let, or even demand, that Labour MPs vote for that motion. Last time the SNP tabled such a motion he blocked that.
Of course it would look better if Labour had tabled such a motion. but it didn't.
Of course that makes it look like Starmer has been dithering, again.
And, of course there will be a political price to pay for doing the right thing and voting for this motion.
But Starmer has to finally do what both the leaders of Ireland and Scotland did long ago, and stand up and share a broader call for a ceasefire.
Will he? I hope so for Gaza's sake.
But I also hope so for our sake. We need leadership with some ethical comprehension.
I even hope so for his own sake. Won't he, one day, want to sleep at night?
But, I will believe it only when it happens. Labour's tribalism makes it a profoundly small minded party. And small-mindedness is the enemy of most things of value, including peace.
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“an end to the killing of innocent Palestinians”
entirely in the “gift” of the Israelis, who seem to be saying “we will stop killing innocent Palestinians once the hostages are returned”.
& Starmer seems to be content with this framing.
Vile.
There are Labour supporters on YouTube saying the motion is merely an attempt by the SNP to provoke a rebellion in Labour. My take is that even if that were true Starmer still ought to support it.
Why should the SNP motion provoke a revolt in Labour, unless Labour now is so revolting that they cannot bring themselves to support a motion that should be supported by every right-thinking person?
Well, if Starmer does not back the motion there may well be a revolt. But it is a bit much to blame this on the SNP, let alone to suggest the SNP is deliberately trying to provoke this situation, yet this is what some Starmerites are saying.
I’m not certain the Labour Party will back the S.N.P motion, for the simple reason the hate the party that stole what they still perceive as their feifdom, Scotland.
Jeremy Corbyn said last week in parliament that he would back the SNP and urged all other labour MPs to follow him.
83% of labour voters back Corbyn on this. Only 3% support Starmer.
Alex wrote “I’m not certain the Labour Party will back the S.N.P motion, for the simple reason they hate the party that stole what they still perceive as their feifdom, Scotland.”
There’s even more to it than that: SNP is now arguably more left wing than Labour, which inches further to the right in a misguided attempt to steal the Tories’ fiefdom. I stress I’m not a member of SNP or affiliated to it in any way, but the fact that SNP has now tabled a Commons motion twice advocating a cease-fire in Gaza where no other UK Political parties have lifted a finger tells you it has strong humanitarian interests as well as its Holyrood stance of governing in the interests of the Scottish people. If you’re in doubt about the latter, just google ‘Scottish Government mitigations of UK Government policies’ – there are scores of them.
Mike Small wrote an insightful piece in the Sunday National pointing out that Independence for Scotland is not the main aim of the SNP (you can read this here: https://bellacaledonia.org.uk/2024/02/18/upturned-boats-and-the-hyper-banal/). Rather, it is the means by which SNP’s principal aim can be met: namely a proper thriving democracy with a proper Constitution where the people of Scotland get to decide policies via the ballot box. Compare and contrast with the present situation where a Government that we didn’t vote for (cf Brexit) and which has little understanding of Scotland, its people, its history and traditions gets to impose its policies on Scotland thanks to the sheer numbers of English MPs and can freely countermand laws legitimately passed by the Scottish Parliament. There is no way, given the current stance of the Tories and Labour and the UK electoral system, that any of the devolved nations can achieve democracy while remaining in the UK. That is the Truth that Westminster and the UK MSM dare not state and that is why the three devolved nations are moving towards independence.
Much to agree with, Ken.
Oh look Starmer vacillating again!
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/19/israel-has-gone-beyond-self-defence-in-gaza-says-labour-shadow-minister
Such clear headed leadership. Labour under Starmer an absolute standing joke for u-turning!
Starmer’s ‘delay in understanding’?
I don’t think so. As Tom Stevenson shows in London Review of Books – its been pretty clear from the outset this is a revenge operation deliberate destruction yard by yard – and 20 or 30 Palestinian lives for every Israeli life .
We could all see that – and why hundreds of thousands were demonstrating every weekend.
Starmer knows this – but decided to keep just one step behind US and UK govt – and thats were he still is and probably will be this week.
Not only pathetic leadership but colluding in war crimes – starving whole population etc.
Revenge is not justice. I am appalled a human rights lawyer is prepared to justify it.
The most bizarre thing about the current Labour party is that like Blair/Brown New Labour they appear to have discovered that the secret of UK electoral success is never to announce major policy differences with the Right-wing Junta that controls us.
Blair and Brown went on to have a good 100 days then 13 years of never rocking the Neo-liberal boat.
This time it looks like Starmer will be the same but without the first 100 days.
It is yet another moment which appears to reveal that the Labour Party will always value itself above anything else. It may have internecine warfare about what it should be, but its tribal fixation is tangible – and the main reason why it can never be trusted by anyone who is in need of any change which threatens its own hallowed existence and its leaders’ careers. Starmer’s speech in Glasgow was staggering in its self-deluding hypocrisy. Could this be the party that, for example, hid the McCrone Report and stole a third of Scotland’s North Sea waters by ministerial fiat the night before devolution? I’m afraid that the discovery of principle, home or now abroad, will always lag behnd its self-love and its hatred of Scotland’s national party.
Thanks
They really are sick bastards. Who the heck cares, other than Starmer, Streeting et al, what party/person lodges the motion. Who cares about how it looks.
This is about stopping further murders of thousands of men, women, children in the most unimaginable ways. Babies are denied decades of life whilst these vile Labour, poor excuses for human beings, are arguing the toss about the SNP motion and whether or not it upsets their perceived position in the Commons. They are playing with people’s lives. Thousands more will die whilst they piss around.
These people should not hold high office. They are selfish, self centred and devoid of humanity. They wouldn’t know compassion if it jumped up and bit them on their well padded arses.
There is IMO a massive hardly reported issue.
BBC 2 Feb. 2024
It says More than 800 serving officials in the US and Europe have signed a statement warning that their own governments’ policies on the Israel-Gaza war could amount to “grave violations of international law”.
This is an unprecedented move by people who think beyond tabloid headlines or politicians’ sound bites.
We don’t know who most of them are but Robert Ford, a former US ambassador likened it to the 2003 Invasion of Iraq
“[Then there were] people who knew better, who knew that intelligence was being cherry-picked, who knew that there wasn’t a plan for the day after, but nobody said anything publicly. And that turned out to be a serious problem,” he said.
Sunak must know about this. When top officials rebel politicians know.Yet he is choosing to ignore.
the whole report is here. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-68177357?fbclid=IwAR1aBlM94dr27bICbwgMalnVeZaT_oJj4YoL3941en3DuWUaoHzQIHKoWhk
I am aware of this quite astobishing move
Agreed and with Mike too.
I tired of Labour’s exclusive rights on doing the right thing in British politics long ago – even before they started to do the wrong things.
You cannot take sides in the Gaza situation in my view because it’s a thoroughly human tragedy. Our job should be to help the each side live in peace and stop killing each other.
We should be on the side of life.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDuIVcWH2-U&embeds_referring_euri=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.patreon.com%2F&source_ve_path=Mjg2NjY&feature=emb_logo
This is a double down News item on the exposure of the UK to Israel. It is very disturbing and may provide some reasons why the UK state & the “loyal opposition” are so very pro-Israel in a matter which, to most people, seems cut & dried i.e. – stop killing civilians. It also suggests that the UK has allowed a foreign power to take control of important state functions. The UK state & its politicians – puppets?
Are the claims evidenced?
Compelling.
But the thing is Mike, these people are not puppets mate.
They’re middle men.
There is no way that the Brits who enable this can be so rich or in such high positions peddling this sort of stuff in broad daylight. So they take their money from behind the scenes things like this and get to rule over us by selling us out to the world.
This has been going on arguably from the 1970’s where money trumped patriotism. And it is all fuelled I bet by the same trope – Britain is bankrupt, a basket case incapable of fending for itself because of the NHS, social security etc., and other lies.
Selling out is the Establishment’s revenge on those who just wanted more equality.
How far they ‘control’ things is open to debate. Control is difficult even when there is a clear hierarchy.
However, influence is not quite the same. The web tells me that up to 80% of conservative MPs are members of the CFI Conservative Friends of Israel. Foreign Secretaries Cameron, Truss, Cleverly and Raab were/are all members.They are among the best funded of all political lobby groups.
CGI website says “campaigns hard for Tory candidates in target seats, and works to ensure that Israel’s case is fairly represented in Parliament. ” It denies taking foreign money.
I wonder, if they speak in the House or appear on TV should they declare they are members of a lobby group for a foreign country?
Yes, in a word.
I agree (i two words)
“We need leadership with some ethical comprehension”.
I think that British flagged ship sailed, long ago; and if it ever contemplates returning to port, the Mail, the Telegraph, and the Conservative and Labour Parties, I am sure – will sink it if they can, without blinking. Our aircraft carriers never leave port, but the British Press are very, very effective; and can torpedo anything worthwhile, that is foolish enough to move. Nobody reads them anymore, but the headlines are easily grasped, credulously believed, and lethal.
https://labouroutlook.org/2024/02/19/the-fate-of-the-free-press-is-in-your-hands-juilian-assange-trial-and-protest-this-week/
Hope that the court gives the right answer for Assange. Otherwise what free press we have will disappear completely.
It is difficult to have much faith that there will be a just outcome.
Julian Assange judge previously acted for MI6
The judge set to rule on the Assange extradition case was previously paid to represent the interests of MI6 and the Ministry of Defence – whose activities WikiLeaks has exposed.
https://www.declassifieduk.org/julian-assange-judge-previously-acted-for-mi6/
The Tory appointee holding Julian Assange’s life in her hand
Judge Dame Victoria Sharp’s family have attained high-level positions in the British establishment after being appointed by Conservative ministers.
Dame Victoria Sharp has been announced as the High Court judge who will next week rule on Julian Assange’s bid to stop his extradition to the US.
https://www.declassifieduk.org/the-tory-appointee-holding-julian-assanges-life-in-her-hands/
There is a real “follow the money” piece on this topic. Read –
nmrm on John Robertson’s site. talkingupscotlandtwo.com
Labour ‘change’ – just a cheap vapid campaign slogan created by someone behind the scenes.
Says it all really!
At first glance it appears that Starmer is calling for an immediate ceasefire. But note the final words on his statement from this Reuters report:
“his aides said his words did not amount to a change in position.”
https://www.reuters.com/world/uk-labour-leader-starmer-calls-lasting-ceasefire-between-israel-hamas-2024-02-18/
Starmer is a lawyer and so is precise with the language he uses. If he wanted to call for an immediate ceasefire he would say “immediate ceasefire”, but he does not. His previous position, which his aides say is his current position, is that he supports a “sustainable ceasefire”. The Tories started calling for a sustainable ceasefire in early January and a few days later Labour did too (the Tories follow the US and Labour follows the Tories). A sustainable ceasefire means a ceasefire when Hamas has been eliminated from Gaza, i.e. never.
I have read the words in his speech several times to try to see exactly for what he is calling and there is nothing there that definitively calls for an immediate ceasefire. He says “That is what must happen now” – but what is the “that” that must happen now? It’s not clear. He says “The fighting must stop now”, but what does that mean – it could mean the fighting must be stopped now by Hamas surrendering. Nowhere does he say that Israel must immediately stop its onslaught against the Gazan population.
Starmer is terrified of the ultra hardcore Israel supporters for whom any deviation from support for Israel’s onslaught is considered to be appeasing or even surrendering to Hamas. He increased their power and entrenched them within the party in order to facilitate his own rise to power but that has now come back to bite him by leaving him fearful of doing anything to upset them, even when it will cost him votes. Starmer is desperate to do as much as he can to stanch the loss of votes without going too far to upset them, and so he is sitting on the fence in the hopes of not upsetting anyone, but that isn’t possible and he has to decide: is he against genocide, in which case he has to upset them, or is he going to accede to their demands to avoid upsetting them by supporting the continued onslaught? Starmer’s calculation is purely based on the loss of votes vs upsetting the ultra hardcore Israel supporters – Palestinian lives don’t even come into his consideration.
For me it’s simple: until Starmer calls for an immediate ceasefire, he has not changed his position and he supports the continued onslaught. I hope to be wrong but I would be very surprised if he votes with the SNP on Wednesday.
Starmer’s position reminds me of the Tories during the Brexit negotiations, telling everyone here how tough they are with the EU while giving in to whatever the EU asked. Starmer’s MO is dishonesty and so he is trying to use complicated language to make it sound like he is supporting an immediate ceasefire to trick people so he stops losing votes, while at the same time not actually supporting an immediate ceasefire so as not to upset the ultra hardcore Israel supporters. He thinks he is being clever.
Except, of course, as usual, he’s being the opposite.
I thi8nk your conclusions are fair based on the available evidence.
I expect Starmer will be thinking he’s played a blinder – waiting for America to move a little, and then following. It keeps them happy with him, and it makes sure that no newspaper can call him a terrorist sympathiser. Imagine how they would have treated Corbyn.
Unfortunately for him, the game playing is undermined by the reality on tv. And he looks gutless and heartless and thoroughly unpleasant. But he doesn’t really need the electorate anymore, we have become redundant.
“But we’re not going to be pushed around by protesters, and we’re not going to be told what to say by our opponents in parliament either.” Wes Streeting
Wondering how Labour MPs will vote on Wednesday? Perhaps they should listen to the protesters and their opponents. They are the ones able to tell right from wrong. Maybe they should consult their consciences, if they can find them.
A question for Labour MPs – do you support genocide or are you against it? It’s a simple question to which they should have no hesitation in answering but that’s precisely what these individuals are doing. In a few short months, those same individuals are likely to be the political leaders in the UK. Does that fill you with hope or despair?
Gazans are being treated like human garbage to be disposed of any which way. Would Labour MPs want their families to be treated in that manner?